depends, there are some combos where silencer support fits it, but mostly its shit support, especially if solo support, no stun, weak slow, pretty much useless.
Well as silencer support it is really easy to zone the offlaner out with your glaives. But still: he doesnt have a disable or a slow. But on a trilane with heroes which have disable, he is good imo
he cant be played as core despite excellent scaling because he cant farm well , cant take safelane , quite shitty mid with no escapes , so he got to be played as support
@The Rider you could say the same about Zeus. But still he is played in the midlane. Silencer mid works imo pretty good, espescially since you can harrass the enemy extremly well. Furthermore you can get lasthits easily
i played him as supp last game cuz everybody went carry and out clock was next to useless
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/3268803500
was good at lanning stage he can turn the lane around as much as he want cant secure kills how ever :v
there is a huge deference between the two that Zeus have a great wave clear which is essential for most midlaners and higher kill potential while also needing alot more levels to scale perfectly , silencer can stay relevant throughout the game with only lvl 6 and boot+ward , Zeus damage increase rapidly with levels
@The Rider well talking about wave clear. What about invoker? He doesnt has a great wave clear, nor a great escape ( most ppl dont skill wex in the early lvls, and even if he can ghost walk ppl just buy dust and thats it ).
Dont think of this hero as a dude who can easily kill ppl at the early stages of the game (like qop or storm does). He needs farm and lvl, much like an invoker.
dude when we assign the role for every member the major thing you take in account is how much lvl and farm does this hero need to do his role the best , now think to yourself , you are going into a teamfight that will determine the game now , would you prefer having your zeus/invoker be lvl 18 and silencer lvl 6 or would you rather zeus/invoker be level 6 and silencer lvl 18 ; in 99.99% of cases anyone will choose the first choice therefore we assign the zoning support role to silencer and the mid to zeus/invoker
despite invoker not having a wave clear at the early levels , he have a global pressure, and he is significantly weaker at early lvls and arguably the highest scaling with lvls of any other hero in dota so simply we cant offer him as support
silencer do scale with lvls and farm excellently , so is monkey king , so is riki , but they can work and have an impact without items and higher lvls so they leave the 1-3 pos for those who cant work without lvls
Rider you're so stupid. Silencer is an excellent mid and excellent carry. He will NOT be relevent with 0 items idk what kind of trash games you're playing
@The Rider I get the pont you are trying to make. Everyone would choose the first option. But why would you even compare it like this. Silencer can be played as a support hero obviously. His ult is his main feature. Zeus and Invoker cant be played as an support, since they need way to much lvl and items to truely shine. So why compare a team which consist of either a lvl 18 zeus/invoker and lvl 6 silencer or lvl 18 silencer and lvl 6 zeus/invoker. In no game the second option would ever happen. If you play a Mid silencer you obviously have a decent support who isnt as much dependent on lvl and items as zeus and invoker are.
Furthermore you could argue about a silencer being uselful without items. The moment the main enemy heroes get BKB's Silencers ulti is most of the time pretty underwhelming, which is why, by your logic, the hero needs farm to do his role the best.
@Samurai calling other ppl stupid doesnt really help to substantiate your point. If you want to prove him wrong, use arguments.
I don't think there is a hero who can beat silencer mid without support assistance. The hero can start harassing you to no end starting from level 1. If silencer can beat lina mid, I guarantee no other hero is going to beat him solo mid, of course this is a team game so it can go either way, you die very easily, even though it's extremely easy to turn around a gank with a tp'ing or nearby support. He farms generally slow but can come online with literally just a force staff and treads, which is not hard to farm up in the first 10 minutes.
"would you prefer having your zeus/invoker be lvl 18 and silencer lvl 6 or would you rather zeus/invoker be level 6 and silencer lvl 18"
When the hell is this ever even a scenario? I understand the concept but that's like asking do I want my safelane carry to be level 6 while my mid is level 18?
@.zaB yes , i 100% agree that silencer is a strong core , it is just the main point that samurai started is "The hero is not a support and never will be" which is not true , so i was trying to show why he is played as support in the first place .
i still believe that silencer strongest scaling 'W' is done better and easier with higher mid pressure by OD which is imo the reason no pro teams ever pick silencer mid
Pro teams are picking him for a different reason, OD would get destroyed by a silencer mid. Silencer isn't a support because he is U-S-E-L-E-S-S as a support, any REAL support hero can be picked with greater benefits than a silencer, take lion for example, lion is useful at ALL stages of the game with minimal farm and items.
@ samurai , the scenario is not meant to compare between the roles rather than the heroes themselves to make assigning roles easier , my point isn't silencer cant be core , it is silencer is better as support so he can give a space for other hero that do provide more in team comp
Well i wouldnt say silencer is useless as a support since he does ( as already mentioned above ) have his glaives to zone the offlaner out, scales well into the lategame and has a great teamfight utlimate.
But i still think that his true potential lies inside the core role
i can argue that any REAL core can be picked with greater benefits than silencer , OD being destroyed by silence mid is something i don't think is possible due to OD spam W almost auto wins the lane but even thou , just because a certain hero win the lane doesnt mean he is a better core , i used to destroy mid as lich/max Q disrupter/bane in 1v1 mid , that doesn't make them any better core
Do you realize how close he has to get to silencer to use his w on early on? This isn't 6.86 OD we're talking here. And that's because those heroes DO NOT scale, silencer has a scepter which means 2 spells are going through bkb, how in hell does not that make him scaling?
Also why do you think they gave him 3.0 agility gain, for shits n giggles? So he can throw glaves faster of course, if you think silencer can't play as core because you think a zues is going to outcarry him or an invoker, a hero that silencer counters hard you're extremely inexperienced. You do realize he has basically OD damage with longer range? Your mentality is that just because he is not a traditional because people seem to choose him as a support for some reason that means he is less viable than other carrys. What exactly makes a carry more viable than other? Doesn't OD destroy late game carries the same way silencer could?
bounty hunter +3 agility gain , monkey king +3.2 agility gain
and no i literally stated in every post that silencer is 100% strong core i don't know how you get the conclusion that i say the opposite , and yes zeus and invoker can outcarry him even if they are hard countered by him simply because hard counter=/= harder carry , every hero have counters , i dont think nyx will outcarry OD or beastmaster will out carry sven , and again i know that silencer is a good carry BUT he can provide alot while having less farm so it is preferable to leave the carry position for other hero
Support silencer is good against bristleback, thats the one of the few situations he excels at.
Lmao
Check my silencer win rate
I play him as pos 5 exclusively
Imo he is too fragile and relies on a good start too much to be a decent pos 2
They can outcarry him, doesn't mean they will. I don't think you realize how silencer functions.
Silencer carry is only good as a carry when you don't have a carry in the team yet and you need his ult.
-BSJ
Also, you have no natural escape for ganks.
If I see silencer carry it's pretty easy kills till he gets maybe a pike/ shadow blade
Silencer support is fine, he does everything supports do except stun so draft him with cores who stun or another support who does and he's fine. You mostly get him for his ult but so what? A lot of heroes revolve around their ult. And he scales very well for a late game support and can transition into a right clicker.
Except his ulti has an extremely long cool down and can easily be baited if not used as counter initation.
He's an amazing lane support, he counters many popular offlaners in lane really hard like Timber, BB, and Phoenix.
because u usually pick silencer for the ultimate and not the rare situation where u can get him to snowball as a core. u dont need to be a core to use his ultimate effectively.
I like to tell people that im playing silencer support then get midas and not buy a single ward >:)
Great harassing, nice situational cc, aoe teamfight disrupts that aren't scaling, generally bad farming capabilities and items independency, way of being useful without items toward the late game , he seems to tick all the points of a support for me
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The hero is not a support and never will be, every time I have a silencer support is the most utterly useless shit imaginable.