after looking at guides, it is clear that i am indeed right and this appears to be the most optimal item progression.
I think u just buy basi and make it into vlads instead of aquila. Or u can go helm instead and make aquila but im not sure. After that u can just do ur regular bkb, abyssal, manta, skadi, ac, mkb, etc.
phase dom deso basher bkb/abyssal
snys awful i believe, mantas good sometimes
heres the one game of pa ive played this patch lol https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2957182909
vlads gives you pretty much nothing for 2k+ gold. you get like the same damage from a ring of aquila. you better invest the 1300 gold you save for buying aquila instead of vlads into a faster desolator.
helm ofc is good for the dominated neutrals but i kinda suck with micro
ur delaying any kind of sustain until lvl 15 if you dont go vlads or vanguard or dominator, idk how you are avoiding running back to base when you get low from diving or getting dove, shrines are only up every 5 minutes and your mid has probably already used it
vlads gives you pretty much nothing for 2k+ gold
Lmao it gives mana regen, more push potential, lifesteal, has a good build up for lane sustain, armor, and damage and you give these effects to your team which suits pa's early fighting playstyle perfectly. You could substitute it for hotd but vlads is still a gr8 item.
Ye now that hotd is an item u buy that. But that doesnt make vlads a bad item, late game u will have one of ur supports or someone pick it up. Btw if say ur mid or off or even support picked up hotd is it still worth it for u to buy it? Or is buying an alternate aura like drums or vlads or crimson or mek or pipe or whatever better? This is a general question.
id get hotd almost every game, this applies for other hotd heroes too
drums on a carry is 99% awful, i never see this anymore the stats are bad and the active isnt worth a carry slot. only see it on CK and i think even thats far outclassed by hotd in every game
i buy hotd instead of vlads on void, that should say something about one item vs the other, hotd has huge potential impact and also kinda counters enemy hotd as well
the items good enough that the slight inefficiency doesnt matter imo
just that you dont feel bad about backpacking it later as a pos 1 for another item
its not like stacking meks where you lose out on 99% of the items value
well i agree with the 'lack of sustain' part of going for aquila, but since i play the hero mostly mid i am the one using shrine... and in general i see pa in pro games always go for this build and it is in guides as well so i wonder how they justify that.
idk how i forgot pas a mid hero just because i play her safelane usually lol
its not a terrible build, the top pa match on dbuff atm is aquila deso vanguard -> abyssal
But then again if you need to replace boots you probably didn't do your job which is to end 30 minutes in and will probably lose anyway
I usually go deso into vlads then either basher or bkb depending on whether I'm snowballing hard or need a bkb badly. imo the lifesteal from vlads is going to be better in a fight than hotd but this is probably more a choice of preferance.
sound stupid but vlads give pa more than 10 lifesteal talent, so after deso you build vlad>bkb>basher etc
I tend to rush a bkb if im against some horrible line up like invo, lion, qop and slardar etc. If you are having fap time farming in the early game rusing a battlefury isnt horrible because you can farm like a mofo for the remainder of the game
still dumb founded that you think vlads gives you nothing for 2k gold. Also I hope you are playing on a smurf because 4 games a pa doesn't make you an expert.
so explain to me then, why is vlads sucha good pa item if it is not being built by pros, and barely any 'meta' builds use vlads?
Most games I see have Deso>vlads or vice versa. lvl 15 seems a bit late to get sustain.
HOTD is probably a good alternative but I don't play PA often so I'm not saying this for sure. From the higher MMR games ive seen though HOTD is basically the new old drums. The stats it gives for its price are so good that people don't mind if they lose some efficiency in the aura. Plus, 2 domi creeps is better than one.
After the core items you get BKB right away if you need it otherwise I usually see Abyssal. MKB is an option if they have evasion. Unfortunately for PA, Butterfly and Daedalus lose some of their efficiency by overlapping with her skills. Maybe Mjollnir is good? I dunno
15% bonus damage aura, 15% lifesteal aura which stacks with pa's tier two lifesteal perk, 4 armor, 3 health regen, 0.8 mana regen (which is plenty), vlads is also one of the easiest 2k gold item to farm up, and accelerates you early game nuking potential and team fight, allowing for mid game pushing and snowballing.
getting vlads after deso is pointless, you already have lifesteal talent then. and getting it before deso means you arent gonna have a min 10-15 deso to win the game.
helm is worth it though because its cheaper and you can dominate a stun creep or a wolf.
You get vlads before deso, it is cheaper and provides more value for a ganking and pushing mid pa, deso is great but you don't need it by 10 minutes to win the game. Also you still never answered whether or not this is a smurf account.
yes it is ofc
almost every pa aims to have a very early deso nowadays, its an insane power spike to have it by the time you unlock lvl 2 Coup de Grace.
PA is weak to nukes and in general that means the squishy supports fuck her over real bad, both in the early game and even later on with ghost sceptes. early deso (said power spike) means you can dagger crit kill almost any support hero already (and most cores die in seconds too lul) while there is absolutely no way they have a ghost scepter or any ehp item.
Yes, deso is great for bursting down squishy supports, but even I, who is not the greatest pa, can manage a 17 minute deso after building phase boots, and vlads. By this time most carries, and supports, will still be far behind you and will still power spike. But one difference between having the vlads, and not is the ability to man fight people. Instead of hiding back throwing daggers, a pa with vlads has the sustainability to fight the other teams right click carries, without relying on crits. In sum vlads allows you to play pa without RNGesus blessing you with crits every other attack.
or you could rush hood of defiance I think a little consistency would be nice for a hero who relies on RNG so much.
Anyway because we will never agree, my build goes: Phase boots, vlads, deso, bkb and vanguard (which ever is more beneficial I build first), abyssal, and finally either butterfly or mkb
I wouldnt consider vlads on PA now that she gets lifesteal in her talent tree. I'd rather put that gold towards a deso / BF / BKB.
anyway i think vlads is just kinda oldchool coz of what ragga said. its just that even aquila gives you more stats and damage than vlads would, even the armor gain is pretty much the same.
if you build stuff like manta, butterfly, skadi, vlads is amazing, because of the 15% agility-based damage increase.
I still usually get my vlads before level fifteen even when I build it after deso. Also having vlads on top of level fifteen talent lets you become a monster because in most cases you will have enough lifesteal to fight several heroes at once even if they have some disables. Once you stand in a fight and kill three heroes with no help you dont skip vlads.
Ring of health is already enough for sustain and builds into abysal. Vlads is fuking stupid useless trash 2k mmr item. Vangard increase hp and blocks damage already plus meld. U dont need to manfight people, what you need is to 1 or 2 crit peoples. only in 2k mmr you can see 2 heroes going toe to toe - theres always another heroes helping out.
unless of course everyone else has died on your team and suddenly you find yourself in a 1v3 and suddenly vlads is very good.
@Me mid Im pro
Ur fucking retarded. What abt 2k mmr supports ur argument besides informing us that ur an elitist douchebag? You dont build vlads for the hp regen only. You build it cuz its a gr8 team aura.
Daddy fuck you. Let team build aura for you. Why the hell you wanna build aura for your team when your team has a dog brain. Your suppose to carry the game. Wtf vlad will do to your teammates like ogre, rubick etc. They dont even right click. Maybe you dont play games long enough already that you forget how pub teammates is.
Lmao when is ur whole team ogre's. Wtf did i say buy it so ur SUPPORTS can right click. I didnt even say its the optimal build anymore and that ur wrong. But ffs this doesnt make vlads bad on pa, just outclassed by helm. A pa shud (imo) be leveraging said early dps in early teamfights (lol see the word TEAM in there), and buy some early items to help her do that. Deso leverges ur dps, and vlads (or in 7.00 helm cuz its better) helps her push fast, and give a great aura which often times tips your team over the edge in the fights, as well as build up from good lane sustain. Just cuz pa rlly shudnt be going vlads anymore doesnt make it a bad item.
And dont act like some 4k god who has a 99% winrate and is never the deadweight feeder, it happens to fucking everyone so shut the fuck up thinking your so special.
PA has big AoE BKB piercing cc and a large area post spellcast silence which also slows down enemies, and goes to farm when these spell are on cooldown, hence the need of vlad
Oh wait
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I know that after Phase and Aquila you buy a Desolator, but what to buy afterwards? Is an Abyssal blade (or it's single component (as in Bsher/VG)) into BKB the best route? or is there something I'm missing? SnY?