First of all, the main problem is the way you get the skills. You definitely CAN'T lvl sun ray at the beginning, low lvl u dont have life enough to waste, maybe u do this to play phoenix as sup and heal ur friends, but think that Sun Ray healing is based on percentage and low lvl NO heroes have much life, so the healing is minimal and doesnt worth the waste of life (u pretty much kill urself doing this). Then u might know that point u should lvl (focus) fire spirits and, later, Dive. Phoenix doesn't need necessarily much life, but healing. So Urn of Shadows is one of the most important items to do and to add some healing and damage to ur skills, u should do Aether Lens. I like a lot to do Ghost Scepter too for Phoenix, so using it and fire spirits u can save time for ur team to come in time. Forget about losing because ur team is overextending some teamfights, it will happen not based on the hero u are playing. And u got only 4 games with Phoenix, go ahead, play more, I love Phoenix gameplay and she's one of my favorite heroes, but keep in mind shes hard to play. :)
Phoenix is an it, so genderless.
Yeah, take it from me, the way I play phoenix is either offlane and sometimes a mid. You're the best team fight hero in the game. Take as many fights with your team as you possibly can. You can't push worth a shit though.
I never have life problems, but I do have some mana problems. I usually go Trans>Urn>Mek>Sell Trans>Arcane Boots>Greaves. Everything else after that is luxury.
I watch pro matches sometimes and they go maxing sunray first that's why. As you can see on my first phoenix, I prioritize fire spirits and icarus dive because it's only for my perspective as a newbie phoenix player. One more question I wanna ask: How do you position yourself in teamfights when casting supernova?
one of my friends are like the best on that hero! check his games!
http://www.dotabuff.com/players/86717663
Get Dive at lv. 1 and never level it again. The only thing that changes on it is the damage. Max Sun Ray by 7. Max fire spirits second. Get ulti whenever you can. (Link here is a game I did this build) http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2363136505 I only have 9 games on Phoenix, but so far I've found this build to work just fine. A bit of advice when planting your egg, always cast the fire spirits right before going into ulti.
I guess you're not into phoenix @Triple right? haha
@Venusaurus Why is there a need to cast fire spirits before becoming a fire egg?
@Neko I understand your build and it's pretty situational. Do you go Midas on him sometimes? For catching up, you know gold and stuffs.
@Sir Wow impressive phoenix player with over 2k + games! Im curious if Aether lens is good on Phoenix and since aether is nerfed, it is still worth the buy?
For catching up? Most of the time, I"m ahead from all the fighting I do, so no.
also maxing sunray first? that's probably one of the last things you do imo.
Dive has static damage, so it's better to have it early on, whereas sunray scales later into late game where everyone has abusrd ammounts of HP.
It would be better if you max fire spirits first, then dive second, that way you can take as many fights as you can early on. Shut down their carry, get a lot of farm from your kills with your team. Group as 5 when you have ur ult, then take more fights.
and pretty situational in 3k = you're gonna get mek/greaves 24/7. Mek is such a clutch save tool for phoenix and your team. Especially if you dive, fire spirits, mek then pop your egg once you time your spirits.
Well if no one is gonna buy it, then might as well and yea, I don't ult right away. I usually wait for the 4th fire spirit to hit something, or wait till my life is like 200 before ulting most of the time.
But phoenix can't man fight alone 24/7. He's really a hero that depends on teammates around to help him. Kinda like engima with black hole.
Also in 3k, if you don't get mek as phoenix it's an instant GG report phoenix. I've gotten muted over that a couple of times way back in the day
@JoEn fire spirits cut the attack speed of any enemy they hit by a lot. 140 attack speed at max level I believe. Having that on them will make them less likely to attack egg at all.
Just don't spam all your fire spirits at the same time,do that and you'll be better then 50% of the phoenix i see playing : )
1) Decide which role you are (offlane/mid or supp)
2) Skill built depends on your role.. if offlane better max the spirits before 7, while @supp you might max sunray.. you SHOLUD NOT max dive at any role before lvl 7
3) teamfights . you need to observe the situation/position of the enemy first. put out your spirits/sunray if they're initianting and then pop the egg. The position of the egg are important, get to highground/away from enemy cluster but near enough for the damage to be taken..
4) Item. Depends on your role. if constantly babysitting other better get midas. Mek are situational (if going manaboots then go for it).
Shivas guard are wonderful late game item, so does aghs and radiance. BKB also good if they got silence. anyhow gudluck playing it.
^
maybe that's why you have a 25% winrate.
Not really much of a Phoenix player myself, but wouldn't you want Fire Spirits instead of Sun Ray early as a support? The insane percent damage isn't really shown in the early game where no one has much hp. Fire Spirits seem solid at zoning out an enemy for a long duration as well.
I play phoenix alot since 6.87. As you can see from my profile, my lifetime winrate is 62%.
But ever since 6.87 patch, my current winrate is 75%. 34 wins, 11 loss.
Prior to contrary belief, it depends on what kind of phoenix you are aiming for.
I play phoenix usually as a zoner support or offlane (semi-carry phoenix).
I'm not going to disclose my playstyle here but just gonna state my item flow (which actually works).
Tranquil > aether lens > urn/meka (see which other of your teammates are getting) > luxury items
Phoenix has too high of a damage output with aether (being pure damage).
I skill 1-3-2-3-3-4-3-2-2-2-4-1-1-1-x-4
Trust me, with aether early game preferably by 15 minutes, you can deal insane damage without mana pool problems
tranquil and aether/meka/urn ensures you have enough health and mana to avoid going home.
Tips:
Learn to control sunray. It is often underestimated by people since it deals intense damage as time passes. Many a times, I see people farming in my sunray for 3 seconds and realised they cannot endure the 4th, 5th and 6th second.
Participate in as many teamfights as possible, constantly informing your team your ultimate cd.
Prepare TPs, wards and all. If you see, most of my games only have 3-4 basic items, Tranquil, aether, mek, urn. More than enough to last till late game. Notice my KDA too. If you TP to help your team, participate in many team fights, EXP and gold comes naturally. Since Phoenix doesn't need much items to be relevant, spam the wards
Good luck with Phoenix. :) you could check out my profile on phoenix for the past 2 months to see if I'm lying :p
@hotsalza spirits decreased your HP by a lot in the early stages too. and you will need to hit 4 of them at exactly 4 seconds each to maximise damage. whereas, when i hit a 4-6 second sunray on my enemy, I decreased around the same health and deal more damage to my enemies while healing my allies. it's more worth it. :) that's why I'm at 75% winrate at 6.87
@salza
it also does flat damage, 135/180/225/270 pure if you get the full duration
I think core offlane phoenix still maxes fire spirit cos it gives you way more solo kill potential in lane plus harassing enemy carry, but I'm not sure on that.
even early on sun ray is really strong. sunray at lv 1 still deals like 200 pure damage to most heroes. plus it's easier to keep a sun ray on someone for 6s than it is to land 4 fire spirits.
Maxing fire sprirts and dive will generally stop the other team fighting or diving, they melt like crazy. You can either heal them or stop damage altogether.
^ This is what I do with phoenix.
But yeah, I have yet to try aether lens on my firebird yet, will give a shot sometime later.
To whoever thinks maxing sunray at lvl 7 is bad on support phoenix, check out my latest games, recently reached 4.8k by spamming support phoenix . U dont have much hp for sunray ? Well thats why u go buy tranquils. 1000 + pure damage at lvl 7 by a hero is just absurd if you use it correctly. You can also check my games to confirm what i am saying .
Wait. People are honestly saying you don't max sunray first on the current phoenix? Huh. You must not watch much pro dota. It's the most insanely broken high damaging and healing ridiculous long range skill thats also an escape in the game. Its broken. Broken. Very broken. Now, if you're offlaning phoenix maybe you don't max it first. But helllll nooooo you always max it on support phoenix. It is the POINT to picking him as support. If you don't see why this is you are massively overthinking the hero or misunderstanding the spell.
I've taken beam at 1 many times. Very easy first blood if your team has setup. Don't write off a skill or autoskill an ability at 1. THINK my friends. Think about your skill choices, especially at 1. More than likely just hold the skill point if you're unsure ... Skill what you need
4.6k for reference. Not a perfect dota player, but god damn if I haven't watched/studied waaay too much dota over the .... lots of years....
Not to worry mates, Phoenix ABSOLUTELY will be the MOST PICKED/CONTESTED Hero @ Manila Majors i'm sure.
I thought Lion would be most picked.
On Topic, Item builds for Phoenix are less important then you ability to actually play the hero. Being able to successfully land fire spirits, knowing when to Ult and being able to aim the sunray are things you need to be able to do to play Phoenix well. This just takes practice, although watching pros play can help.
Also for offlane Phoenix I would recommend maxing fire spirits first.
For Support, maxing sunray first is the current build.
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I had a terrible 25% winrate on phoenix. I love the hero so much cause his skills are complexly beautiful. I have a good game with this hero most of the time but in the end, I still lose. I try to be as mechanical as possible while manipulating sunray and healing my team. Last game with phoenix, I felt disappointed. We won pushing at 25th mark but my team was kinda overconfident and they started to dive thru t3s. I tried my best but I think this will make me stop playing him and watch how pros play him?
How do you play this fiery mechanical bird?
谢谢!